Dating of Hudson Tube Whistles NEWS ! Victorian & Post Victorian Times By Stamps….

Victorian and Post Victorian General Service whistles made by J. Hudson & Co. before 1902 and Post 1902 system for Dating whistles by Stamps.

A Guide to Dating J. Hudson Whistles.

This is a work is certainly great news for whistle collectors about Dating the
J. Hudson & Co. whistles  in The 19th Cent and the early Part of the 20th Century.
Dating Two Note Tube whistles – T.N.T.W
(Also known by function as GSW – General Service Whistles)

The article is based on CAREFUL OBSERVATION of  STAMPS and DETAILS brings a new set of thumb rules when dating Hudson whistles.
some points here are really for the ADVANCED COLLECTOR.
This article is a  great addition, in fact a ground breaking and makes it possible to precisely date whistles which previously was done by mare address, The best addition to the tools of dating J. Hudson & Co. Police whistles and none police whistles as G.P.O and other services.

For many years the dating system was based on 4 basic elements shapes of a whistle’s parts (see interlude ).
These are:  The Mouthpiece, The Loop, The address on Body and the one which one can not see without looking into the whistle itself that is the Diaphragm disk construction. Most advanced collectors are familiar with these and use to determine the date.

We learn that the address does NOT always correspond with date made , or serves as an always an accurate tool for knowing the exact year-date made.

Many marked 13 Barr St. where actually made later at 244 Barr St and stamped with the older address . This explains a 13 Barr st. address stamped whistle with a military date of 1910, 1911, 1912, 1913 for example.

I will try to bring it in a chronological in 3 Main parts :

Interlude
Table one and variations in a closer look
Table II and variations in a closer look

So take a CLOSE LOOK at the stamps :
—————————————————————————————
Interlude

( As interlude a general view of Pre 1902 in the first line and Post 1902 in 2nd line : Stamps and whistle 3 main whistle parts, The next Three charts deal with each of the parts separately . )

The Mouthpiece
The early one is what I called ‘apple’  mouth Piece 1883 -1885
Second is the the ‘Sand clock’ shape 1886 -1920’s
and the third the ‘flattened Sand Clock’ 1920’s -Late 30’s
the-mouthpiece-variations-for-j-hudson-co-whistle-museum

The Loop
4 Main Types of loops in  J. Hudson & Co. Tube whistles
Thin Concave 1882* -1900
Thicker Concave Loop 1901 -1908
Slightly concave on a two part top of Loop – Ring and cap. and Flat  ring 1908 onward . There are more variations looking at the loop from the other angle,
Viewing the hole , for example the later D shaped loop.
4-j-hudson-co-loop-types-and-periods-whistle-museum
* 1882 is rare , made at 17 Mark st. few are known so in general we start at 1883 .
A General Chart of J. Hudson stamps , General View Pre and Post Victorian Period .
stamp-variations-on-hudsons-general-service-whistles

First PRE 1902 Table I Chart   Ia, Ib

Table I

 

I a


the-m-in-met
Table Ib

table

I c Example of more details    1887
No space between 131 and Barr St. ( the grey seems to show that clearer )
southshield

Post 1902 Table II , and More II a, II b, II c

Table II a Shows THE MARK THAT PROTRUDES out The J. Hudson stamp in ARCHED LINE letters (Pre 1902 ) and in STRAIGHT LINE (POST 1902 )

Table II

Dating Hudson TNT whistles  (Two notes Tube whistles ) post 1902 Chart. Two sub periods, 1902 to 1908
& 1909 – 1930s
General View
1909 to1930s Chart of Hudson & Co Stamps on Militarary & Police whistles

 

J. Hudson & Co. The 1902 – 1906 Two Note Tube whistles – T.N.T.W
A closer  look at stamps ;

 

II a
Table II a Shows THE MARK THAT PROTRUDES out to the bare eye and is EASY to see:
The J. Hudson stamp in ARCHED LINE letters (PRE 1902 ) and in STRAIGHT LINE (POST 1902 )
john

   1906 was lately updated

II b Particular additional observations  1906 – 7

II c
There seems to be a flaw in a lot of the 1908 whistles. It seems that the stamp was damaged and the top left quarter of the ‘O’  in   J.HUDSON  is missing.
1908-flaws
II d
Patent in 1914 on is in STRAIGHT LINE BLOCK LETTERS
patent-date

II f
Closeup of the Figure 13 Barr St.
1902 to 1905 The figure 1 is written as one staright line(American style) with no “tail” (European style)
The figure 3 has a short top line without a “angled corner”
close-up-of-13-barr-st
II g
A Closer look, We  know about the moving to 244 Barr st in 1909 but the dating chart made goes by dated whistles.
They were stamped 13 barr st UNTIL 1913 :
Picture shows 1910 to 1914 whistles
1910-to-1914-military-whistles-whistle-museum

Just a close Look at Loops and tops by J. Hudson & Co. from the years
1883 to 1918
Some collectors collect the Military whistles that have the YEAR DATE
The first one observes is 1899 and I had seen theae up to 1986 so soon there will be 100 years of dated years , we noted that the 1906 is very rare and so far seen on a Cavalry ring whistle by Hudson . a 1906 by DeCourcy was observed .

years

1902 to 1914 Military whistles and stamps close up.

I would like to thank John from whistle collection for his special insight effort and research here as well as contributing the graphic layout.   Since there were constant updates and it should be updated as this is still an on going research with many small details discovered through the years, which I did not always have time to update.
Questions and comments are welcome .
Look up for coming articles with fantastic discoveries, 2016 was certainly the best for absolutely amazing whistles and makers of the past new facts that change
many of the facts we knew from previous books and articles.
info@avnerstrauss.com
All rights reserved 2016
Best Regards Avner Strauss

 

whistlemuseum

 

8 thoughts on “Dating of Hudson Tube Whistles NEWS ! Victorian & Post Victorian Times By Stamps….”

  1. I have a J Hudson & Co whistle with The Metropolitan N.S.W. Police stamped on it along with the address being 244 Barr Street, Birmingham. I presume it is nickel plated. At the top the cap has a thick chain holder, and at the base it is the shorter version. Would I be right in saying this model would be about 1930? There is no serial number on it.

  2. I was interested to read about the dated military whistles. Your article mentioned that the 1906 miltary whistle is quite rare. I have a Hudson dated 1906 with the small crows foot under the Hudson patent. The 13 .Barr st address is in the same font as the the 1902 – 1905 whistle

  3. Hi, I have just come to own an old whistle and wonder if you can assist in dating it etc. It is brass with a very good patina and comes with a brass lanyard. It has stamped on the the round body ‘The Kinglet” and then underneath ‘Hudson’s Patent’ and then under that ‘L & S W …. (I cannot read the rest).
    I can send a photo if you require.
    I look forward to responses.
    Thanks , Kay

  4. Hello,
    I wonder if you can help me. I have an old The Metropolitan police tube whistle which seems to be unusual in that it gives the J Hudon &Co. address as Barr st. Hockley, without a street number. It does not appear to have been worn off, although most of the plate had been worn off the brass. I’d be happy to send you photos if you think this is an unusual item – I’m trying to date it. Kind regards, Paul

  5. I have a Metropolitan whistle which does not fit any of your descriptions. It is labelled THE Metropolitan. Below that there is a stamp which says N.P. There is no number for Barr Street, and no serial number either. Family lore says this could have been used in Nigeria by the police there. Would be grateful if you could shed some light on this.
    Many thanks

  6. I am trying to date what I believe was my Grandfathers whistle from 1st world war. There is not a date on it the word PATENT is straight letters but word is curved. there is a dot after 13. is there someone I can contact?

  7. Hi I have just stumbled across your website it is really interesting and we’ll made just a quick question if you don’t mind me asking , my grandfather passed away recently and left me a whistle as well as other items it is a lovely thing where can I find out about it and how to protect and clean it it has the acme city whistle patent f.w flight whinchester any help would be great kind regards , Aled

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